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Local Items: Brutal Attack 2
Bonaire Talk: Local Items: Archives: Archives 2001- 2004: Archives - 2004-07-01 to 2004-12-31: Brutal Attack 2
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David F Pascoe (BonaireTalker - Post #22) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 9:36 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

At approximately 1:00 a.m. this morning, Tuesday, October 12, a home in Sabadeco was entered by three armed men. They wanted money. When they were told there was no money of any great amount in the house they proceeded to beat and torture the occupants. One was beaten beyond recognition and the other was mutilated with a machete and burned with cigarettes.

The men who did this were armed, masked and in black, much like the three armed men who beat and robbed another house in January of this year. The severity of the crimes is escalating. The next step is likely to be that the guns will be used to kill someone if no significant amount of money is available to them. It is important to know that while SSS responded rapidly when contacted, it took the police over an hour to arrive.

I really hesitated to post this information but I think it is vital that accurate and timely information is available to both residents and visitors to this fabulous island. If the information enables anyone else to modify their behaviour and avoid such encounter then I believe the post is appropriate and valid.

I have no intention of continuing this thread with sensational comments but I do believe that substantial pressure needs to applied to the authorities to resolve this problem on the island. It would be appropriate to appreciate that this happened a very short distance from the Andrea dive sites that are some of the most popular night dive spots outside of the resorts on the island.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian (bcj.) (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #136) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 9:48 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

What is your source of this information?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie Babcock (BonaireTalker - Post #84) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 9:56 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

OMG, If this posting is true, it is truly, well, I can't think of any words right now to explain how I am feeling. Dave, please tell us how you came upon this information. This is very hard to comprehend without some validity to your post.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By David F Pascoe (BonaireTalker - Post #23) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 11:32 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

My neighbours... 2 of the nicest people that you will ever meet.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jake Richter (Moderator - Post #5190) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 11:37 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Reports from Bonaire indicate there was an attack last night (exact or even coarse details unconfirmed) in Sabadeco, and that at least one of the victims is in the hospital and was beaten so badly as to be unrecognizable by someone who knows her well. This person we have been told is in the hospital is someone who has volunteered in our gallery - not sure of the status/location of her husband at this time.

Linda and I are shaken beyond belief by this attack on friends of ours, and at this point not in the least unhappy that our home on Bonaire has metal bars in all the windows and at all the doors.

I also hope that the perpetrators are giving due justice, Texas style, instead of the pansy justice system the Antilles are saddled with.

I'm sure as the local media covers this attack that more will appear here.

Jake

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Debbie Babcock (BonaireTalker - Post #85) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 12:10 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Jake, Linda, My heart goes out to both of you. I certainly hope that whoever did this to your friends and David, your neighbors are in our prayers for a speedy recovery. I am truly at a loss for words hearing this type of tradegy on Bonaire and see no reason to do such a violent act to a human being. David, thank you for posting, I know it was hard for you, but better to be aware, and prepared than not.
This is, by far, the worst I have ever heard happening on Bonaire.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marcus L. Barnes (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #201) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 1:13 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Unbelievable - again. The fact that these guys felt they could get away with something this brutal is disturbing. Clearly, they have no fear of the Police or being caught. I still think Dutch Police should be deployed to Bonaire. I will be there in 10 days. As always, I refuse to yield to thugs. I appreciate David posting this. We will take the necessary precautions to ensure the odds are in our favor against something like this happening to us. 10 Days and wakeup!!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy P (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #220) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 1:24 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Truly a sad state of affairs.

Nothing new to add to the many anti-crime discussions of the past, just a reminder that when you outlaw guns, ONLY the outlaws have them.

That and since this brutality was committed against locals, it highlights the lawless atmosphere that is slowly developing. Those who perpetrate such deeds have, in my humble opinion, opted out of the human race and deserve no sympathy and the greatest of punishments. If there are stout enough trees and short enough ropes on Bonaire, perhaps the citizenry can devise a workable solution.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian (bcj.) (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #137) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 1:28 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

David: Are you saying your neighbors were your source of information, or that this happened to your neighbors?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jason thomas (BonaireTalker - Post #84) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 1:45 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

This is a warning to the people of Bonaire to remove their thumbs. Do you guys vote for the mayor or governor or whoever? Or, are they appointed?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Israel A. Sanchez (BonaireTalker - Post #74) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 3:11 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

When I read the heading I was hoping that someone would be exagerating, or simply trying to get our attention. Sadly, what had been predicted for awhile here, amid the denial of a few who keep insisting "it's just petty crime, just take your precautions" has happened. The nature of such crime is beyond brutal and barbaric. It points to miscreants without fear of reprisal, acting below human level. To torture and beat-up somebody to that extent, that simply points to sick minds stripped of all human dignity. My well wishes go for the recovery of the poor victims and their families. I hope the culprits receive vigilante justice, which although illegal, has been quite effective in many South American countries.

Friends, please let us all pay attention to what is going on. I believe that Bonaire is like an old dear friend to all of us. One day we started noticing how our friend started leaning towards the wrong path in life. We tried to help him, but he refused our help. The situation increasily grew worse, but despite our efforts and the realization that he was heading for the path of self-destruction, our friend still did nothing about it. My point is, until the authorities do something concrete about it, the situation will continue taking a downward spiral. Did you notice how they reacted when visitors threatened with not returning to the island? They again promised... and still nothing. My thoughts go to all the generous, honest people of the island, and those who still want to give it a shot. Please stay safe and come home safe. To all those naively voicing that the crime situation was being "blown out of proportion", will you please stop looking for the Easter Bunny and recognize there's a problem? Beyond writing letters, what else can we do? I feel both disturbed and angry, since I'm trying to put myself in those poor victims's shoes, and imagine all the anguish and pain they are still undergoing, and how scarred they will be for the rest of their lives. So if anyone commits the stupidity of saying that the problem is "isolated", please keep in mind that it could've been anyone of us or our loved ones.

Marcus, though I would love for you to crack some skulls open, I wish you a safe an uneventful trip, and the same for anyone heading there. Jake and Linda, please let us know if there's any way we can help that poor family. Either financially or some other way. Thanks to all for your time. Coach Izzy

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Lisa Barclay (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #295) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 3:18 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

David, Jake and Linda my prayers are with you and your friends as they recover from this horrible crime. I am also praying that the men responsible for this are found and held accountable so this doesn't have to happen to anyone else.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jake Richter (Moderator - Post #5192) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 4:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Brian,

Yes, the victims are David's neighbors in the Sabadeco area.

Latest word is that the husband's wounds (which did include machete wounds) have been treated and he's been released, and the wife is still in the hospital.

I've sent a note out to someone coordinating activities in Sabadeco to see what, if anything, can be done to help. I think prayers and good wishes are certainly a great start.

Jake

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cynde (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12442) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 4:20 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Jake, please tell them that they are in our thoughts. And if there is anything that we can do, please let us know. I am very shaken by this as well.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Fiona Rattray (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #274) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 4:42 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

David, Jake, Linda, your neighbours and friends are
in our thoughts and prayers.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carl Pflanzer (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #113) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 5:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

My thoughts are with you today as I sit in my office in *safe* New Jersey. As badly as I feel for you and your neighbors and the Richters, I hope this is not a random act of violence which can in the future happen to anyone. I shall offer my prayers for a quick recovery. I too shall not yield to thugs and will visit again in January.

If a thug planning this sort of violence is repelled or retaliated against in a like manner and it results in their injury or death, it might send an appropriate message to the rest of the scum.

Carl

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian (bcj.) (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #138) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 6:21 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Jake: Thanks for clarifying.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jane Marie Garchinsky (BonaireTalker - Post #74) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 7:14 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am sadden by this. I don't normally but I will say a prayer for the victims. We are frighten by the possibility of being a victim as well. Are the victims native Bonairians? I hope that doesn't offend anyone. Does anyone have the feeling that this was a planned attack or an opportunistic type occurance? If I understand the current rule of law prohibiting excessive force and using just enough force to repel your attacker; That needs to be changed! Someone needs to set a precedent. Our flight was cancelled by AJ recently I'm not as upset now as I was when the call came in.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carole Baker (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4208) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 8:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I'm speechless. cb

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Eileen Kimmett (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #6683) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 8:17 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am very sad reading this thread. First question, why do people have to be like this?

Jake, Linda, David, your neighbours and friends are in our thoughts and hearts.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Myers (BonaireTalker - Post #45) on Tuesday, October 12, 2004 - 9:47 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

(Written by my wife the travel agent) Jake, Linda and all those others that are living in paradise under bars and a corrupt police department. I'm so sorry for this last attack. We have been bringing a group there for the last five years and have just started organizing another trip for next spring. This puts a lot of pressure on me as a travel agent as to whether I want to do this to any of the repeat people, much less the new ones interested in Bonaire. What else can we do, or can you do to get this addressed as this is the life or death of your economy!!!

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Mike Dunn (BonaireTalker - Post #44) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 4:03 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Wow...I'm so sad and disgusted!

Can anyone disclose the location? I was robbed myself in Sabadeco last June in a rental house at Crown Courts 44a, which had been hit a few times. I was wondering if it was close.

http://www.oldbonairetalk.com/newsgroup/messages/24/168148.html?1094785091

I have dived over 225 times on Bonaire in the last 5 years. I'm sad to say that I might have to skip a few years until this gets under control. Sadly, I thought it was just a matter of time until something like this would happen. When the robbers were so brazen as to enter the rooms of our sleeping children while we were there, it isn't very hard to believe that this would happen. I hope that since the authorities are doing nothing, perhaps the business people will stand up and do something about this quickly or more Bonaire lovers like me will spend their money elsewhere for a while. If I were to bring my family there and my wife or mother were beaten like this, I wouldn't be able to forgive myself.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Andrea & Dave Bartlett (BonaireTalker - Post #21) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 11:19 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I am from a small rural town (pop 3500) in Texas and we have the same types of crime that everyone is so concerned about on Bonaire. This happens world wide. Unless we are going to hide in our homes and not do/go anywhere we will encounter crime. All we can do is be prudent in safety measures. Bonaire still has a lot to offer even if it is not Utopia. Andy

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alex & Susan Brown (BonaireTalker - Post #36) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 11:49 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I live in Sabadeco year-round. I am afraid. However, I have to say that while I am obviously horrified by the brutal attack on my neighbors, I am also horrified by the suggestions of some here that vigilantism is any kind of solution. I believe that violence is rarely the appropriate response to violence. I don't pretend to have the answers to this problem, but I think that working within the system to force the police to protect us will be far more constructive than resorting to lynchings. I don't know the victims of this crime well, but I doubt that is the type of 'justice' they have in mind either. I also suspect that the culture of fear that would undoubtedly result from our taking the law into our own hands would create a Bonaire where none of us would want to live or visit. I hope that all who read and post here will offer their support in any and all efforts made to put pressure on our officials to catch and punish the perpetrators of this crime, and to ensure our future safety. I and other Sabadeco residents very much appreciate your concern and good wishes. Thank you.
Alex Brown
P.S. Jake, I'm relieved to hear that window bars make you feel safer--we're getting an estimate tomorrow...

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carl Pflanzer (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #115) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 12:19 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I would agree that violence is not the ideal response to violence, but if two men with machetes entered your house and attacked you, would you be better protected with a weapon of your own, or a telephone? It took the police an hour to arrive for God's sake, and the woman was beaten beyond recognition.

In certain situations, the time for innocence and naivete is over. This is 2004. This scum does exist. Stealing $20 from a car at a dive site is one thing, assault and murder is another.

Carl

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy P (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #224) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 12:30 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Alex & Andy,

As a proponent of lynching myself, I admit that it may well not be much of a deterrent to crime, but it sure cuts down on repeat offenders.

Bonaire has YEARS of past experience working within the system to make things better. How's that working out for you? It seems that losing a pair of cheap sunglases and flip-flops pales in comparison to the frequent type of "crime" now being experienced.

ALL tourists to Bonaire know two things"

1. Only Bonaire can fix this problem.

2. It's only a problem now for those tourists who decide the present level of risk to themselves and their families is worth the trip.

2a. It's not a problem for me in the near term, so what do I care? I don't live with bars on my windows here in Chicago and don't think I'll opt for them on "vacation".

Yes there is crime EVERYWHERE there are humans. Most other places decide to have some level of actual law enforcement to try to keep the bad guys under minimal control. I have NOT heard any local folk praising their men & women in blue.

My two trips to Bonaire in '01 and '02 were adventures in paradise. You cannot imagine how deeply it pains me now in '04 to watch my dream destination slowly degrade into a nightmare.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alex & Susan Brown (BonaireTalker - Post #37) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 1:14 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I was not suggesting that people do not have a right to defend themselves in their homes, although statistics show that hasn't worked very well in the US, where many more innocents are injured or killed by 'home protection' weapons than are intruders (but that's a topic for another debate). People should have that right. But it is one thing to defend oneself and quite another to hunt down the perps and 'string them up'. What we need is effective policing and prosecution, not angry citizens or visitors distributing 'justice' where they see fit. I was simply suggesting that we use our anger constructively rather than destructively.
Alex

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Margarita Murphy (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #1) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 1:34 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Hello all,
I've been a dedicated lurker for nearly two years, ever since I fell in love with Bonaire in 2002. Ever since then it's been my dream to take a sabbatical, rent a simple, secluded ocean-front house somewhere on Bonaire and write 'my' book. This dream is being cruelly shattered by the recent reports about escalating violence on Bonaire. A highly saddening development.
I had a similar experience in Portugal in the late 80s which forced me to sell my little dream house there. Because I have difficulty coping with violence.
My thoughts and prayers are with the victims, and I hope with all my heart that the local police force will realize how detrimental these developments are for the future of Bonaire.
Margarita

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marcus L. Barnes (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #202) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 1:37 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Good point Alex; however, the police on Bonaire aren't getting it done. These dirt bags know this and are targeting Bonaire because they see it as an easy hit - path of least resistance if you will. It still seems to me that home alarm systems, common here in the US, would help to deter this type of activity. I'm okay with staying in the resorts and villa complexes that have security measures in place but there is no way I'd rent a stand alone house on Bonaire. I've always been curious as to why these lst line precautions (i.e. burglar alarms) are not being used on stand alone houses on Bonaire. My guess is that the perps above would have been much less interested in conducting this type of unspeakable act with an alarm going crazy in the background - no guarentee of course but better odds none the less. Why the bars instead of alarms? Hang in there - it'll get better.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jane Marie Garchinsky (BonaireTalker - Post #75) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 1:41 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

With all due respect, that's a wonderful theory, working within the system, trying to change the corrupt police department and all that. But when god forbid, you, a friend or a loved one are lying in hospital bed, if they are lucky enough to get there in the back of rusted out double cabin, replaying the events. I guarantee that theory will seem very thin. Write some letters, attend some rallies if that makes you feel like you're improving anything but invest in an axe handle pronto. And please don't keep it in the locked closet next to the windows that are bolted and barred. These animals are going to continue their crimes with more frequency and severity. There is no realistic deterrent for them. They enjoy the power! The culture of fear, when will it arrive? Muggings, theft, burglaries, home invasions, torture, mutilation, house sitters, guards at dive sites, bars on the windows and doors, corrupt cops..I'd say it's is alive and well.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy P (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #225) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 2:16 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Alex,

You are quite right and perhaps there is a "tiny" amount of poetic license in my comment. Don't hunt them down and string them up, just break their legs with the aforementioned axe handles so they can't run away in the hour or two or three it will take your "police force" to mosey on by.

I do NOT expect that the tourist population will stand for being deputized at the airport on their way in to become a part of the crime solution. I WILL tell you that the areas of the USA that have laws that allow the locals to carry concealed firearms have lower incidents of personal assaults. Thugs and bullies RUN from potential harm to themselves and flourish in an atmosphere of fear and even worse, official apathy. I will also tell you that most tourists probably won't visit areas where they feel unsafe. Want to join me at the Bagdad Hilton this weekend? Or the Sudan Super 8 Motel?

The troubles on Bonaire are sadly symptoms of the VERY early stages of how you become a third-world toilet that NOBODY visits. Only Bonarians can affect change. Only tourists can vote with their wallets till there IS change.

I wish you unbridled success.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carl Pflanzer (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #116) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 3:30 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

My sources on the island tell me that the alarm system was not activated, and there was little money in the home at the time. Can someone confirm this?

Carl

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jan van der List (BonaireTalker - Post #14) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 4:07 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Today I spoke with a couple of people who should know. And yes there was no money in the house.
And yes the alarm system was not activated simply because they did not have a chance to activate. They were attacked after just going to bed. they immediately beat up the lady and kept on asking for money and every time the husband said that they did not have any money they put a burning sigaret on his arm. They also cut his back with a machete.
What I understand there will be a 5000 guilder reward from the prosecutors office for anyone who can tell who these animals are.
They were left tight up with straps around arms and legs. After a while they could free themselves and called the police. police answered that they could not come right away since the had only 2 people on duty.

Today they published a photo of the beaten up lady in the local paper. This was with her permission and is supposed to be a warning for residents like ; if this animal behaviour is not solved, you could be next.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carl Pflanzer (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #117) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 4:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Thank you Jan. I hope they find the scum, although I don't think the criminal justice system will prosecute to fit the crime. Very sad indeed.

Carl

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jan van der List (BonaireTalker - Post #15) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 4:42 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

In a small community (like Bonaire)crimes are sometimes solved because there is always someone who knows who these animals are. A reward could do the trick. I remember after the killing of Mr Pleumeekers and his wife 5 years ago, they issued a reward of 10000 guilders. The police "solved" the murder days after that.

Yesterday the getaway car (the car from the victims) was found in the same area they found the getaway car after the previous robbery. (Does that ring a bell??) Start asking around I would suggest to the police.

I remember driving through united states (as a tourist ; I am dutch) and sometimes I saw these signs like neighbourhood watch or something. Does anyone of you yankee people know how this works or does it work at all and could this maybe a solution for Bonaire too??

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Jane Marie Garchinsky (BonaireTalker - Post #76) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 4:50 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

All this reference to the alarm...Big Deal! On or off what's the difference? The authorities are not responding anyway. Oh, right, maybe the noise will annoy the pigs and they'll find another target in a quieter section of town. Guess what! The perpetrators are well known! Those maggots just don't get a bright idea and act out of character pulling a stunt like this willy nilly. Anyone with any knowledge of the community knows who is capable of such a crime and who did it with reasonable certainty. The usual suspect list can't be long. If the cops won't help and if the native Bonairians won't help, YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN! Pass at your own risk and cover your ass! What is your life worth to you.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cynde (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12458) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 5:23 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

I think the problem is a very complex problem (I'm only speaking from what information that has been provided by the residents of Bonaire). I do know that there are other Antillean islands that suffer from larger crime rates and offenses, and have the same frustration. Prior to going to Sint Maarten last Spring, I spent a lot of time researching the island, lurking on talk boards, etc. Just for a perspective (and the problems they have with number of police available...i.e. the Simpson Bay PD office closes at 9PM), on this one thread there are 4 posts of crimes since July 2004, one, tourists being beaten with a baseball bat.
Sint Maarten.

Again, I am just sickened by this, and David and Jan, please let this couple know that there are a lot of people sending healing thoughts their way, and again, if we can do anything for them, please let us know.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Randy P (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #226) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 5:25 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Hi Jan,

The Neighborhood Watch, has two basic "types". One involves actual foot patrols by residents with police radios who report any suspicious activity, the other is where signs are posted in home windows and sometimes on the street indicating that ALL suspicious activity will be immediately phoned in to the local police station.

BOTH programs require commnity support and far more importantly start with an active, functioning police force that responds IMMEDIATELY to Neighborhood Watch calls and radio reports. At least that's how we do it here in Chicago. It DOES work. Maybe it only drives the bad guys to areas where there is NO neighborhood watch and constant police attention, but it's a start in the right direction to reclaim our streets.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cynde (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12459) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 5:37 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Jan, here are 2 links with information on the Neighborhood Watch Program. We have one in our neighborhood. Randy's right. It takes involvement and commitment from the residents. We have a monthly or every 2 month meeting to report any news, information, etc. Our local police department supports it as well.

http://www.usaonwatch.org/

http://www.citizencorps.gov/programs/watch.shtm

It might be worth you while to get your neighbors together and discuss what you can do.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Linda Richter - NetTech (Moderator - Post #2021) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 5:38 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The alarm system does not go to the police station it goes to a security company which did respond within minutes of it sounding. Unfortunately, the victims were only able to sound the alarm after the attack was over.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Vince DePietro (BonaireTalker - Post #55) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:10 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

With great sadness I see the slow cycle of escalating violence continues. With every "crime" being committed the bar is being raised one notch higher than the last "outrageous occurrence" which is barely perceptible on a day-to-day basis. I believe there is true malevolent evil in the world.
I suspect many of you may not agree with this posture, but cretons like the assailents in this incident is one of the reasons why we have (& I firmly support) capital punishment in the U.S. These animals have formally given notice to civilized society that they are unfit to live in our midst! They deserve the most extreme form of punishment. My sincere sympathies & best wishes to the victims of this atrocity.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Greta Badstebner (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #604) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:12 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Ditto on what Randy & Cynde said about the Neighborhood Watch program. It DOES work with well-functioning support from both the citizens of the community and the local police force. We have one in my community.

Just getting caught up on the threads today. This is absolutely terrible news. My heart goes out to the victims. I will pray for an easy and quick recovery for them, although nothing like this is easy.

Jake, Linda & David~ Please keep us posted on the condition of the victims as well as the status of the perpetrators (if they're caught).

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Al Schroedel (BonaireTalker - Post #46) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

In the continuing absence (for years) of motivated and effective law enforcement, and considering the bleak prospects of any real improvement in the forseeable future, visitors have fundamentally two choices, i.e., stop visiting, or visit and hope you won't be injured or killed. The drug culture spillover from Curacao and elsewhere, coupled with Bonaire's failure to successfully deal with crimes from petty theft to felonious assault and murder, makes coming to Bonaire an increasingly dicey proposition.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Cynde (BonaireTalk Deity - Post #12461) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:39 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The picture of the victim is in the latest edition of the Bonaire reporter with a story. Again, PLEASE give this woman and her mate hugs and condolences from me, and that she makes a speedy physical, and mental recovery from this horrific crime.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By seb schulherr (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1712) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:39 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Two things:
1) Every dwelling should have bedrooms with heightened security. Even if it is only a large deadbolt, anything to delay the attackers. Bedrooms should also have alarms to contact the security company.

2) Should you harm an assailant on Bonaire, you might end up being in much more trouble than your attacker.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alex & Susan Brown (BonaireTalker - Post #38) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 6:59 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

There has been quite a bit of speculation about the details of this horrible attack and in the interest of clarifying matters we would like to share the information that we have received, both from our homeowner’s association, and from a Sabadeco resident and friend of the victims’ who is on the committee working on this situation (i.e. working with the police and the Island Council on behalf of Sabadeco). We have been given permission to do so.

1. The victims did have an alarm system, but it was not activated because they were concerned it might be set off by a cat they were taking care of. It is believed that the perpetrators entered the house through a window (possibly in the kitchen) which was (possibly) unlocked. The victims were overwhelmed so quickly that they were not able to get to their alarm’s ‘panic button’ in time.

2. The female victim was in fact beaten horribly - we have seen her photograph. In addition, her husband was cut with a machete and burned with cigarrettes.

3. While the police may have been unresponsive to date, we are told that the Island Council is taking this very seriously. They have asked for all relevant information, photographs, etc.

4. A reward has been offered through the prosecuter’s office. Flyers with a photo of one of the victims will be posted ‘advertising’ this.

5. The female victim is still in the hospital but is doing better. She is an incredibly courageous person.

In posting this, it is not at all our intent to add fuel to anyone’s panic, only to provide information amid speculation. This is a terrible situation which we residents of Bonaire must find a way to overcome, and that’s what we are trying to do. We have only just begun, and we are hopeful that we will prevail.
Alex & Susan Brown

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Israel A. Sanchez (BonaireTalker - Post #75) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 7:19 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Agree with Seb 100% about harming a Bonairian (sp?) assailant. What are the laws in this case? Do they protect the scum more than the victim? The way things are going, I would not be surprised if the criminals have kinship relations with the higher officials, who would not hesitate to arrest the victim for harming one of their "beloved family members". Let's face it, there's not much we can do from here. Like I mentioned before, we can limit ourselves to writing letters and threat with not coming to the island. We can already see what results that has produced. I believe that it would be a great wake up call for all those politicos if Bonaire was placed on the Department of Travel warnings. For those of you who still insist with the irrelevant "there's crime everywhere" You are either in denial or simply don't get it. No One in this board has mentioned any place as being "safe" 100%, and in case you have not browsed the previous reports, what outrages all visitors is not the presence of crime per se, but rather, the apathy and indifference of those who are supposed to protect their citizens. One hour to arrive to the scene of the crime? Give me a break!

I would like to mention Puno, Peru. Near Lake Titicaca, Early January 2000. The citizens had seen what the purse snatchers where doing to the Tourism. They also knew that their police would rather watch soccer matches on TV and play deaf to the constant crime reports. As of October 1999 they had implemented their own watch. They were not hesitant to administer justice quickly. I witnessed a thief who after getting caught was stripped of his clothes, lashed, had his head half shaven, paraded around town with a "thieves beware" sign, and then tied up in the main square until the cops came to free him. The locals were telling me that by doing so they had reduced dramatically the crime in the touristic areas, and the neighbors and business people always warned tourist as to what areas to avoid and around what times. That is just one example of how citizens fed up with the abuse of thugs and indifference of their authorities dealt with the situation. This is common practice in many places in South America. Are we encouraging vigilantism? No, Bonaire's own Government is. It has not surfaced yet, but as down-to-earth as Bonaire's citizens are, there's only so much abuse one can take. I do hope the government does something before it gets out of control. Once again, a safe and uneventful trip to those still going. Coach Izzy

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Penrose (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #9) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 8:46 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

It's interesting how rewards do tend to work and lead to arrest. I for one plan to contribute to any reward fund that has been established, or another that could be started by private citizens. I would suggest, if any of you want to do something that may make a difference, that you consider contributing as well. Rather than contribute through the prosecutor’s office, I would be willing to contribute to a private reward fund that would be administrated by someone on the island that we all can trust to be a voice for all of us. Any thoughts or ideas?

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ron Myers (BonaireTalker - Post #46) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 9:07 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

From the above post, and believing there is "no honor among thieves" I think increasing the award amount is a good idea. This is not vigilantism per se; just attempting to help the local police do their job. I would be more than willing to contribute to such a fund to be paid to whoever might assist in the arrest and conviction of those responsible. Please keep me posted if such a fund becomes a reality.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Israel A. Sanchez (BonaireTalker - Post #76) on Wednesday, October 13, 2004 - 9:16 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Count me in as well. That's a good idea. Coach Izzy

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By HT Heller (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #2) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 8:18 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I think that it is a pretty sad situation to have to tempt the police with a monetary reward in order for them to do their job.

Does anyone know whether the Sabadeco Owners Association has discussed the possibility of gating the community? Is that not an option on Bonaire?

I must say, I am currently poised to purchase a house in Sabadeco this very moment, but in light of these apparently uncontrollable events, it may be worth taking my chance on a more expensive, hurricane-prone but safer island such as St. John.

It would be an absolute shame for Bonaire to go the way of Curacao, St. Croix or parts of New York City, where I live, but unless something drastic is done soon, this may be a steep precipice from which there is no return.

My deepest sympathies go out to the victims. No one should have to endure what they have.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Gary Steven (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #10) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 8:27 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

Any reward would NOT be paid to any police for doing there job. It's for any private citizen that can help in the arrest and conviction.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Carl Pflanzer (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #118) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 8:59 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I don't know about the reward although it sounds good, but I've never heard of anyone getting one after they turn someone in.

Unfortunately this attack happened to residents, after Regatta week. From what I heard of what went on during the previous week, it's certainly possible the scum filtered in from Curacao and parts unknown and hadn't filtered out yet.

If I recall correctly the number of tourists each year averages about 35,000. I could look up the crime statistics, but I don't know if 'violent crimes' percentages are that different from even the best Caribbean island. If there are 5 'violent' crimes a year affecting the 35,000 tourists and 9,000 residents, I'll take my chances. This is assuming the rest are petty theft and minor drug problems. No place is perfect. Does anyone have the hard statistics for violent crimes?

Carl

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By HT Heller (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #3) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 9:29 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I do not know the statistics for Bonaire, but St. John USVI I believe has had only two armed assaults (neither one fatal) since 1999. Mind you, they only have a population of 4-5000 but the Islands as a whole receive 2.5 million tourists a year.

Gary, thank you for clarifying the reward situation.

I realize no place is perfect, but every citizen has a right to feel secure in their home, whether it be during the day or while they sleep. To have to resort to guard dogs or iron bars may not be the best long term solution as it doesn't get to the heart of the problem.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By J.J zambrano mazzei (BonaireTalker - Post #49) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 11:59 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

I´m very sad for this news, Violence must go out of Bonaire...it´s like a terror movie..Bonaire USE to be quiet,Pacific, and all this violence is new here .the crime is everywhere in the world but crime with violence ......! I saw this kind of crime in curacao but never in Bonaire. Imported Violence ? Yesterday a policeman told me "this violence is caused for drugs".....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brian (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #684) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 2:30 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

We too are deeply saddened by this outrage, we wish a speedy and full recovery to the couple. Lets hope that the reward brings out the offenders and that they get suitably dealt with for a long period. Zero tolerence should be used here.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By GMLIII (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #3) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 3:05 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The most disturbing thing about this tragedy is that the residents were bound with SCUBA equipment. If this was a burglary, there was no reason to torture - yes, torture - these people. As they were bound, there was absolutely no reason to beat them, burn them or slash them. That was simply gratuitous violence for its own sake. Sadistic. Such violence was not needed for this burglary.

And...all of this for what I understand to be about US$ 50.

Concerning one of Carl's points, I am informed that authorities are fairly sure that the perpetrators are Bonairean - not from any other island or S. America.

On perhaps a more positive note, I have learned that the [though I hate to use the word] victims intend on remaining on Bonaire.

Thoughts and prayers are with them.

Incidentally, if a posse is sent out, let me know. I'll come back down for that.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Meryl Virga (Supreme BonaireTalker - Post #4201) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 6:44 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Well this is a whole different crime now....How horrible...and I am in shock at seeing the picture of that poor women.
Busting into cars for change or gear is one thing...(a bad thing no doubt!) But to beat up and torture someone... ..this is a horrible bit of news!
With the island being almost 90 percent divers....they should be in an uproar! No reward should be necessary! Someone knows who these animals are...and they are either locals or not?! It is a very small island......

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By arthur ginnetty (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #10) on Thursday, October 14, 2004 - 11:50 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The Reward Poster is posted over on scubadiving.com

My limited experience has me thinking this was not a radom attack. In the US this type of beating, burning and cutting type of crime, in many cases, is a payback or they had info that large amounts of cash or other "commodities" were to be at the house that night.
ATG

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Susan Porter (BonaireTalker - Post #75) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 6:26 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

This attack is about perception. The neighborhood that has been attacked twice now is perceived as wealthy. The people that were attacked did not, in fact, have a lot of money in their house which may be why they were beaten so badly. I have held my voice until now. Please do not create more problems then we are already have by adding misinformation to the mix. Misperception can and does hurt us all.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Susan Porter (BonaireTalker - Post #76) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 6:37 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

To qualify, yes, Sabadeco is very upscale but what I am trying to do is make a point.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Robert Crumley (BonaireTalker - Post #41) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 12:59 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

In September, for the first time ever in my many trips to Bonaire, I saw actual drug deals in the middle of the street, by a very young lady, who had just been handed the drugs from a car with curacao plates. This was in broad daylight,on Kaya Grandi in front of the Bookstore, with many people around who just ignored what was happening. A couple of the men lit up and were smoking a joint right in the middle of the street, being ignored by everyone around. If the community leaders of Bonaire continure to stick their heads in the sand and pretend that all is well, I'm afraid when they pull their heads back out, the tourist industry will be wiped out because of their indecisions and not taking care of the problems when they could have "nipped them in the bud", before things escalated.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By George Blanchard (New BonaireTalk Poster - Post #9) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 3:22 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

We are not divers but are snorkelers and long time Caribbean travelers. We first went to Bonaire in 1993 and have returned regularly. Our 10th trip will be in January. However, it is imperative that Bonaire protect its reputation as a safe place to visit. We used to visit Jamaica in the 60's but drugs and crime have taken that place off our travel list.

In 1986 while in Grand Cayman we were in an area that had a petty theft. Their police responded immediately and promised quick action. Because of help from Caymanians the thieves were caught the next day and given rather severe "Caymanian Justice." Bonaire police and its citizens need to work together in a similar fashion to maintain a safe vacation area or the pipeline of tourists will close rapidly.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Alex & Susan Brown (BonaireTalker - Post #39) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 5:35 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

We would like to clear up a little more misinformation:
1. The victims were not tied up with dive equipment.
2. There has been no official statement regarding the nationality of the perpetrators.
3. 90% of the population of Bonaire are not divers!!! This crime was not directed against divers, or tourists. It was a crime against residents, against people believed to be wealthy. We residents, foreign and Antillean, have to find a way to work within the system we have, and strive at all costs to avoid contributing to any perceived cultural differences.
4. Gating the Sabadeco community has been discussed in the past, but such a course presents many logistical, financial and other difficulties, not to mention broadening any perceived gap between residents here and other parts of the island by isolating the people of Sabadeco.
5. We have not been able to confirm the rumor that there has been an arrest. Since it has been several hours now since that post, our guess is that it is sadly untrue.

Rumor, speculation, panic and hysteria are not what we need now. Constructive advice and best wishes are most welcome. We just want to focus on a solution.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brigitte Kley - Coco Palm Garden (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #190) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 7:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Robert Crumley, why don't you (or others who saw similair actions) write what you saw to some people in power and to the Extra. All info we can give to these commisonars and the lt. governor makes them stronger against the minister of Justice on Curacao ... who is responsable that the police (and immigration and custom) is such a disgrace on Bonaire - after the last e-mail action in June/July the police was working for a few weeks .. and than they think that everybody has calmed down and they stop working again

Here one more time the addresses

Gedeputeerde van Tourism:
Burney Elhage
elhage@bonairelive.com
Bestuurskantoor
Plasa Wilhelmina
Kralendijk Bonaire
Phone +717-4020


Gezaghebber Herbert Domacasse:
gezag@bonairelive.com
Bestuurskantoor
Plasa Wilhelmina
Kralendijk Bonaire
Phone +717-5330 tst. 220

Ramonsito Booi ( Statenlid)
rtbooi@bonairelive.com
Ministerraad Bonaire
J.A. Abraham Blvd.
Kralendijk Bonaire
Phone +717-5330 tst 117/118

Extra Bonaire
E-mail Address(es):
extrabon@telbonet.an


 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By C Poteet (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #233) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 7:58 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Brigeitte -

In response to your request, you realize, I'm sure, that many who could and who desire to respond do not speak nor read Dutch.

If possible, would you please be so kind as to translate the titles of the individuals you list and tell us the correct form of address for each.

Many thanks and only the best wishes for the people of Bonaire.

Charles Poteet
Dallas

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Marcus L. Barnes (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #203) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 8:13 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Just sent emails (again) to the addresses posted above by Brigette.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brigitte Kley - Coco Palm Garden (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #191) on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 9:06 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Mr. Elhage is the comissioner of tourism
Mr. Domacasse is the lt. governor
Mr. Booi ... I don't know, but I think for the moment he is the head of the island council.. he is the head of the party in power (UPB) and he is/was member of the central parlement
The Extra is the most important news paper in papiamento and has up to now always used a big number of letters written to them as articles

As to the correct form to address them .. I am not Dutch either .. just be polite and nobody will be offended ... when we meet them somewhere we use their first names ....

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Glen Reem (Extraordinary BonaireTalker - Post #1885) on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 1:55 am:     Edit PostPrint Post

In regard to the 'community leaders of Bonaire putting their heads in the sand', please remember that this is all about the rule of law and these leaders have no legal authority to police.

The police are Central Government employees: Bonaire has no way of making the Central Government police stationed on the island (the only police authority on the island) do their job. And they don't do the job, as we all read. Curacao has far worse crime than Bonaire just because the Central Government doesn't enforce the laws there. Sad but true. And notice that RC''s selling car had Curacao plates.

As Brigitte said in a thread above, a change is government is needed and hopefully coming, if too slowly for all of us.

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By C Poteet (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #234) on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 1:25 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

Brigitte -

Thank you for posting the additional details, in English, for the authorities.

Charles Poteet
Dallas

 

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Brigitte Kley - Coco Palm Garden (Experienced BonaireTalker - Post #196) on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 6:15 pm:     Edit PostPrint Post

The Extra today published quite a number of comments from BT and some mails they received ... but the today editon is not on the web yet ...

 


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